Estudiantes de la Plata Champions of America!

I am surprised and happy that we managed to beat Russia in Russia. A strong result. Offensively this game was a step up, a good game by Aguero when he finally played in the position where he is best. To pare him with a true #9 is the right thing to do. But what do we do when Messi is back? If Aguero is played as a second striker then we have to use Messi in midfield, and that will never happen…….sadly……This game also showed us that our defence, like always, is still a mess!!!! And Andujar did a mistake when Russia scored 1-0…..I still do not see a real first class goal keeper, but hope to see Carizzo get his confidence back in Zaragoza. I am sorry but I have a feeling we will be eaten alive against Brazil because of our weak defence. Our hope is Messi. If he can turn it on, maybe we can get a result even if Brazil score 2 or 3 goals…….

Posted from  Norway

I think the best option for the win is to put Messi in the midfield and play a 9.

But we will see.

Posted from  United States

I think Cambiasso and Mascherano would work if Messi was in the midfield too, btw, but only if.

Call me crazy.

Posted from  United States

BTW, guys I have the game downloaded. If anyone have not seen it and want to see it, I can mail the files, just in case you are interested.

I have plenty to say about the game. Have taken all my notes. Will post soon…

Posted from  United States

My lineup (the best LOL)
———–Carrizo
Zanetti—Samuel–Burdisso—-Heinze
–Maxi R.-Mascherano-Cambiasso
—Messi———-Aguero
———-Higuain
With that classic “barcelonna” 4-3-3, the main advantage is to use each striker at his best position, Messi especially.
The only “little” change is for Cambiasso, who should play as Left Midfiel, like a iniesta in fact. But this is the weak point defensively, not because of Cambiasso but because of Heinze, which a bit slow. That’s why we got Gutierez each time.

Get me a fast left back and there’s no weakness; who ? Monzon ? Zabaletta as left back ? tell me guys
tell me what do you think about, even if diego don’t select CAMBIASSO HIGUAIN and SAMUEL, tell me about the lineup strategy.

Posted from  France

maradona (the loser,the mad man,the idiot,the donky) 3

guess the genius the champ the experienced 2

argentina away and a b team

BUT MARADONA DOESNT KNOW WHAT HE IS DOING

YOU GUYS HAVE ISSUES

Posted from  United Kingdom

andujar – (5) – He was just OK. He did not have much to save. Others he conceded. Wasn’t bad either. I see this as a another experience for him.

Zanetti (7) – Very solid again. He also stopped some cross and shepherded away the russians well. Participated well in attack.

Burdisso (4) – A good solid header. Very slow. Casual in defending. Poor performance over all.

Otamendi (5) – One of the many players to keep an eye on our left side. Again a slow defender. Cannot run faster than an attacker, simple.

Heinze (5) – This is dsivided in 2 parts. A rating of 2 in first half and 7 for the second half. Very slow again. Needed Jonas, Otamendi, Bolatti to help him in the first half. Solid second half.

Mascherano (7) – Good solid performance. Great long passes. Perhaps the best long passes of the day came from from him. We really do not need a double 5.

Maxi (6) – Good. Pairing up well with Zanetti in defense and attack nicely. That side of the pitch is looking good.

Jonas (6) – Did all day what he is suppose to do. Work hard, help others. He did those right. Made some good runs. Lost some balls. Those will always be there with this guy.

Bolatti (5) – Casual mistakes. Nothing special at all. Will not keep his place.

Aguero (8) – Sharp. What a goal. Very good perfomance. Should have passed to Milito though.

Milito (7) – Very good game. Great short passes. Nice build up with aguero. Very good performance. If you are surprised, watch the game again, please.

Lisandro (6) – Good goal.

Datolo (6) – This guy actually looked good. Got a good left foot. Would like to see more. Interest is on.

Lavezzi (6) – Decent. Poor man’s Messi.

Battaglia (2) – What a liability. His first contribution was almost a disaster. I don’t want to see him again. PLEASE!

Diaz (1) – Horrendous, funny and a not for the weak hearted. Pathetic.

I took notes all the game. I have noted down minutes of play for my findings. Will share them sometime. Then we can debate.

Posted from  United States

Wamdiego10
Here is my thoughts about your line up

1. No Burdisso.
2. Someone other than Cambiasso for left mid. Cambiasso is great, just not in that place. Basile did that. May be Lucho and swap with Maxi.

Posted from  United States

Firstly the positives. A win which is rare for any side to acheive in Moscow and with a side consisting of ‘three’ first choices is not bad on paper.

Looking deeper its more luck than judgement on ‘el numpto’’s part.

The record in friendlies has been great but when it has come to the real acid test of competition football, he’s been found wanting.

At last Aguero was played in his playmaking media punta role allowing him a free role to find space and run at defenders rather than having a defender up his backside all the time with him facing away from the goal. A superb display in all areas of the game.

I think most defenders woud have nightmares seeing him or Tevez split the role in a game esp.when tiring in the second half. A good tactic to have.

Still why Milito is playing (despite his good link u play with Kun)is a mystery as his mobility in comparison to other more capable ‘9’s in Cavegol,Higuain and Licha is far more limited. On the other hand he twice set up Kun and Kun (I do not like his selfish streak at times did not pass to Milito who was free ready for a simple scoring shot with the goal free).

I give credit where its due and Bolatti after a nervous start settled well and brough some much needed mobility in an advanced central role but not vision. He has improved at Huracan but whether he can maintain this form is to be seen as after all he did not suceed at Porto (admittedly with few chances). There are better choices for his role.

The ball was not cared for at times and the loss of it led to many needless attacks and it is in modern football that teams such as Brazil pick up on the transitions to lethal effect. Russia while good are not in that class in terms of pace vis a vis skill.

Maxi was a bit below par and Jonas gave his full energy but whilst championing him last year to cover down the left flank as he did against Brazil in the 0-0 draw his technical limitations are a compromise say against a di Maria who is far less inclined to work back in a 4-1-3-2. Depends on the opponent I guess. But we need a guy with that spirit in the side.

Datolo worked up and down well and showed good positioning to come in off the flank for his goal.

A nice debut indeed and good squad option and a good substitution no doubt suggested by the assistant coach for the subdued Maxi.

Aside from Burdisso (who brought threat which is missing from set pieces)and Andujar (who with time in serie A should improve further) Heinze was rash again and left Semshov to waltz in down the right side of the penalty area.

Indeed both centre backs were dragged out of position a number of times which indicates the weaknesses still remain. A shame Angeleri is injured as yesterday was an oppurtune time to throw him in not to mention the likes of more gifted players : Higuain over Milito (despite his physical advantage at present), Gonzalo over Otamendi (who while he made some solid tackles showing promise , still does not read the game well allowing several runs in behind him from Roman) ,Pastore over Bolatti.

Going the other way precious little activity down the flanks which has been a key to previous sucess (indeed any teams) with Maxi and Jonas as the two wide players or indeed both full backs. However in this formation there is not a need for either to overlap high up the pitch.

Which is a positive in one sense that even a weak team such as this afer struggling to gel initially sparked well later. But what more could be acheived with better personell ?

It’s not time to be carried away as yet again el numpto bollixed thigs up again by bringing on Battaglia in a double ‘5′ when the midfield needed to breathe as with the more traditional 4-1-3-2.And with such a deep backline it invites pressure doubly.

Lavezzi also like Zarate (who has improved this area of his game)needs to develop an idea that the game is a team one. Its not Ronaldo time or Robben time Ezequiel.

The defence is still porous and defences win World Cups .Russia like France before them dominated the first half despite Kuns initial misses.

However having caught bits of other matches last night the number of weak looking defences must leave a large number of coaches worried.

People are getting carried away if they think this is the start of a seachange in fortunes. Until the right personell are selected and formation settled on as it was initially yesterday then the horror show against Bolivia and the woeful second half against Ecuador will be repeated.

Argentuban has pointed the deficiencies out and Skywalker too ie the defending of the free kick (why an earth do those in the wall turn to the side .. it creates a greater chance of the ball deflecting at an angle to the goal rather than back to the taker of the set piece) and because of the slow nature of the back line a prediliction for moving closer to our 18 yard line, inviting the opposition onto us.

Set pieces need work again .A couple of good ones can settle games at this level. Delivery generally esp.since the loss of JRR has been shabby with little imagination in the taking either which is a shame as we have several very ood dead ball specialists.

Its great to win any game but the real tests are coming and based on the last few qualifying games I’ll reserve judgement to see if el numpto is taking on advice at last. Personell wise apparently not.

Re Colocinni dear Maxi he gets caught under the ball and flat footed by anyone with pace and his sole resort is to impede them by any means he can. He chases around too much like a headless chicken rather than watching his opponent leaving said opponent often free.

He has been physically roughed up and found wanting and any coach worth his salt would tell his forwards now to do that.

I don’t blame him so much as in a defence where your centre back partner is constantly changing and the midfield infront of you don’t offer much in the way of support (the seperation between forward and back for Newcastle has to be seen to be believed) but nonetheless I have never rated him at all.

And Jonas too suffers. His pace is electric and the rest of the Newcastle team is very sluggish so by the time he reaches the byeline (which he does not do often enough for the NT) he has to wait for support allowing the defence to rob him.

A poor team can affect a players confidence but generally a good player still remains a beacon amongst the shambles. Colocinni is not that. His attitude also sucks. Rather than fight and get on with it he wants to run away from the sinking ship.

I’m sure aside from a few unwanted ‘lepers’ we all want the same thing, Debashish and you too Maxi. Hopefully this team can forge ahead despite the idiot in charge.

Lets not forget this team has so many available players under 22 which bodes very nicely for 2014 and 2018 as well.

PS having watched sections of the 62 WC Messi can be called the new Garrincha. Same slaloming diagonal runs with incredible close control and more often than not a deadly finish.

Re Romero skywalker I watched three games inc.one against Groningen and Romero was confident at coming out to catch the ball under some intense aerial bombardment notably Marcus Berg. He still does allow the defence to collapse towards him and needsto be more verbal.

My preferred line up would be:
———————-Carizzo———————
Zanetti——Gonzalo———Dimichelis—-Insua(?)
———————Mascherano——————-
Messi—————-Pastore————Gutierrez-
—————–Aguero—————————
————————-Higuain——————

Subs:
Romero
Garay
di Maria
Cambiasso
Cavenaghi
Tevez
Battaglia

Angeleri for Insua should be the solution.

Nice mention of Garrincha Aurelius.

IMO, one of the five greatest players ever.

I didn’t mention the free kicks issue though. That was someone else. I wouldn’t know because I haven’t seen the game.

My points were regarding how the formation and lineup Maradona used were forced on him by injuries and fear of injuries, not by any smart coaching on his part. We need to keep Gago out of the lineup and use a 9. Then we need to pray for a decent night out defensively I guess.

Posted from  United States

so when are you guys gonna post a new topic?

Either they play 4-2-3-1 or 4-4-2 0r 4-3-2-1 the most important thing is to have a good keeper between the post and a solid pairing of center half. If they want to play with 4 at back then width needs to be provided by full backs so there should be no Heinze in the team.

————————Andujar/Romero/Carrizo—————————-

Zanetti————-Demi————Samuel——————–Monzon

in the reerves: Gonzalo, Pareja/Garay, Angelari/Insua/Zabaleta

in a 4-4-2 the midfield and attack should be:

Messi————Masch————Veron/Cambiasso———–Aimar/Di Maria

——————Milito/Lopez———–Aguero/Tevez—————-

in a 4-2-3-1 the midfield and attack should be:

—————Masch————Veron/Cambiasso———–

Messi——————Aguero/Tevez————————-Aimar/Di Maria

————————–Milito/Lopez——————————

in a 4-3-2-1 the midfield and attack should be:

——Veron/Lucho———-Masch—————Cambiasso/Maxi-

——————Aimar/Messi—————Aguero/Tevez———-

————————–Milito/Lopez——————————

So by selecting the following 23 players the team can be deployed in various formations depending on the opposition and situation:

GK: Andujar, Carrizo, Romero
Defence: Smauel, Demi, Gonzalo, Pareja/Garay, Zanetti, Monzon, Insua/Angelari
Midfield: Mach, Veron, Cambiasso, Lucho, Aimar, Maxi, Di Maria
Forwards: Messi, Milito, Lopez, Tevez, Aguero, ? (Higuian/Zarate/Levazzi)

maradona still sucks….euro teams give us lots of room

a friendly won does not mean we are doing well

friendlies are not important..we can win all the friendlies we come across but it wont matter if we are losing to Bolivia and Ecuador and Paraguay…lets just say we are the new whipping boys

Gentlemen,

Fiorentina have confirmed that they are interested in Argentine starlets Eduardo Salvio and Ezequiel Munoz

regards

We won our previous two friendlies against Scotland (only 1-0, team that is not Cup bound and sucks) and France (they barely beat Faroe Islands 1-0 and have been in disarray for nearly a year now).

The only reason we beat Russia was because of the forced formation changes – forced by injury. No Gago and a #9 = more success.

And we still gave up 2 goals. The only truly impressive victory we have had under Maradona was against Venezuela, who is also not Cup bound. Colombia was not a deserved victory.

Maradona plays the same formation he played against Russia with Messi healthy and finds a coherent back line, we have a shot.

Maradona claims no rift with Higuain

http://www.goal.com/en-us/news/1771/yahoo/2009/08/14/1440190/maradona-denies-rift-with-real-madrid-striker-gonzalo

Bull. Lisandro over Higuain? The man is lost.

http://persemprepallone.blogspot.com/

On my blog I have wrote about the current situation Argentina has. Check it out

Great post Aurelius. Off course I find it great as it aligns with my thoughts. I agree with most of the points with you. Only, I rate Milito a little higher and thought he was very good. He could have had a goal if Kun was not so selfish.

Agree totally about Coloccini. Playing him as a CD is a blunder. Overall he is very poor and also complained that he was told Newcastle could play in Europe. That’s childish comment. Since you are responsible for it too. West Ham was also in shambles, when Tevez saved them. Even Jonas talked about trying to save Newcastle. Anyway, enough about Coloccini. I will never consider him a decent player and I do not want cheap personal abuse talking about him either

Need to get a good left back. Choose a couple of available good players. And it just may not be that bad. I am HOPEFUL!

Posted from  United States

We’ll find out who will be called up on the 21st maybe even earlier. If Higuain isn’t there I’ll be so pissed.

Posted from  United States

Debasish, can I have a copy of the game that you have saved? my email is mfgt2@yahoo.com Thanks!

Posted from  United States

Re: Collocini – he was decent, but I don’t know what happened at Newcastle. A lot of players go there to end their careers. But also when people claim he was outstanding for Depor. its because he played in a 5 man defense. Depor. played a 5 – 4 – 1 when Collocini was there.

Other than that, I think he’s just mediocre.

Posted from  United States

mfgt2,
I will send you the files once I go home. Expect an email from me in about 3 hours.

Posted from  United States

ajNYHC,
That is a fact about Depor. They played strange (not in a bad sense) a 5 man defense. Coloccini played a lot as Defensive mid as well as a left back. I myself posted here of trying Coloccini in left back.

Kevin Keegan made a statement that someone who has played 20 odd games for a NT like Argentina, has to be an awesome defender. He also asked Steve Taylor, the under 20 England stopper to learn from Coloccini. Soon Steve Taylor was teaching and bailing out Coloccini in the field. People who watch games would know about numerous such instances. I had to conclude after watching Coloccini for 3-4 years and this guy is just an average player (in every aspect of the game – speed, technique, strength, position etc etc.) who just got lucky. He is probably only as good as someone like Lionel Scaloni or Leandro Cufre. Just got plain lucky and played some more games. I would be really surprised if he gets a nod again.

AND LASTLY, AS I HAVE SAID NUMEROUS TIMES – IF HE DOES WELL, GETS HIS ACTS TOGETHER AND PLAYS GREAT GAMES FOR ARGENTINA, I WILL BE THE FIRST ONE TO COME HERE AND SHOUT FOR HIM!!

Posted from  United States

Some enjoyable and fun videos for all Albicelestes over the globe if you haven’t already caught them on youtube in preperation for the Rosario game.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZE1I6k6oaik
Very catchy and affectionate. Any Argentinos know the group behind this ? Its certainly not Bersuit.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dj3axDv1iEo
A nice electronized tango.

Saludos.